Unknown Speaker 0:00
Chris, welcome to The Dogs of our lives Podcast. I'm Chrissy Messick, your host and owner of the nature of animals. My dog training and behavior consulting business, get ready to hear journeys from challenging behaviors to heartwarming successes and everything in between. Our episodes will feature personal stories from clients, colleagues and professionals, all centered around our favorite animal companion, friends. Each episode, you'll gain insights and valuable tools from those that have walked the path that you are on with your dog. We'll discuss mindset shifts, growth, training, tips, lessons, learned and so much more. By the end of each episode, you'll feel inspired have a deeper understanding of your dog and walk away with actionable steps to improve both of your lives. Welcome to our last episode of season one. This is our holiday episode, and I talk with Bridget Chesney, who is the clinic manager for the veterinary behavior center. She's also certified in predation substitute training, and her and her husband Greg own the barking dog cafe in Lyons, Colorado, so be sure to check that out if you get a chance. And I talk with Bridget about the best way that we can bring an animal into our home for the holidays, whether it's a surprise or you're preparing for it. So we talk about the best way to prepare. We talk about how to keep it stress free during the holidays, and then we talk about what comes after the holidays. We also touch on predation substitute training, and I'd love to have her back for another episode. I'm so glad you're here and enjoy and let's give it a go.
Chrissy 1:37
Hello, Bridget, thanks for joining us on our final episode of the first season. Yay, yay, congratulations. Well, thank you. It's been fun. I bet we know each other from the Humane Society of Boulder Valley when I was volunteering there and you were working there in a couple different capacities. So you just want to, I guess, tell us a little bit about yourself, where you live, what you do, and the current dogs in your life.
Bridgette 2:07
Yeah, of course. I'm Bridgette Chesney. I am the clinic manager at the veterinary behavior center, alongside Doctor Ariel Fagan and the talented team she has assembled. I joined her in 2022 after 25 plus years at the Humane Society of Boulder Valley in a variety of roles, I started entry level, the way many shelter employees do, and I quickly advanced to supervisory roles and management level roles. And then probably the last 15 years, I was in a directorship. My title was the director of animal behavior and sheltering. I had oversight of the animal sheltering side of the business, so adoptions in Lost and Found, and then the training and behavior department public and like behavioral support programs for the animals in our care. And I loved it so much. And I'm still involved in slight capacities, fairly consistently, and I do recall you and a variety of other volunteers in the training center. Yeah, so and now I live in Longmont. I live with my husband, Greg. We own the barking dog cafe in Lyons, Colorado, and I have a fairly wonderful pet family. I have two dogs and the most magnificent cat and three box turtles. My dogs are a five year old Chihuahua, Siberian Husky cross, based on her DNA results, and four year old whip it. My chihuahua mix came from the Humane Society of Boulder Valley, and my Whippet is from a local breeder here in Colorado. Hmm, fun. How long have you guys had your cafe? Gosh, 15 years or more. That's so, yeah, yeah, it's moved a couple of different times on the same side of Main Street, and we were minimally impacted by the flood of 2013
Unknown Speaker 4:01
but going strong, even throughout the pandemic. So happy about that.
Chrissy 4:05
What's your favorite thing about it?
Bridgette 4:07
Primarily my responsibilities are after hours, like all of the decor and the social media and the coupon, you know, special that kind of thing. So I like to go out after hours put on Sirius XM Grateful Dead, and, you know, clean and kind of, you know, nod to whatever holiday is relevant at the time. And but I think really, what I really love most about it is Greg and I met waiting tables in a coffee shop style breakfast joint and we co managed for years. He still just loves every aspect of it. And I think it's just really fun to watch him love what he does the same way that I love what I do. Yeah, being a family that doesn't just punch the clock, yeah, you're always doing something.
Chrissy 4:58
And it sounds like it's a little Bit of your like, creative side of you coming out a little bit.
Bridgette 5:03
Yes, absolutely, yes. I love the Old Main Street architecture, and the building that we're in is 100 plus years old. In the basement of the building that we're in, it still has the flood line from the old Thompson Flood. There's just so much history. Lions is such a terrific small community. Everyone has is so supportive, yeah? So I enjoy that very much.
Chrissy 5:29
Yeah, that's fun. So can you just tell us a little bit about your professional journey? You told us a little bit about it already, but if there's anything you want to go into more detail about, like, specific things that really stand out to you, you know, at the Humane Society and currently at the veterinary behavior center,
Bridgette 5:48
yeah, absolutely. I think I've really maximized my experience. I recall I went to the Kent State University, and I focused on early childhood education, and I always knew I would enjoy working with children, animals, plants or seniors. That was kind of my quadrant that I was kind of hoping to select from. I'm too introverted to work with plants. I thought that would be risky, and I was wanting to move out of the restaurant business so that Greg and I had a more varied life, and had, you know, developed different interests and things, and the Humane Society of Boulder Valley was advertising, this would have been in 1995
Unknown Speaker 6:35
for part time, full time positions. It was a group interview. I think 25 people gathered in a room and shelter manager at the time, who is now a local Colorado veterinarian, introduced herself and talked about the mission of the organization and and I was just immediately sparked, like I just wanted to be involved. I checked both full time and part time, but I wrote in parenthetically volunteer, because I just was like, please call me. Like, just call me. I had not historically been in employment where volunteerism was popular so you know, and I wasn't encouraged as a child. I wasn't the candy striper at the hospital, I wasn't shelving books at the library, and I was restaurant working and, you know, there really is no such thing as a volunteer bus boy. So I was just kind of enchanted. And so I didn't even realize at the time that volunteers were already a thing, and I thought I was like, really uniquely offering something that, you know, they hadn't thought about.
Unknown Speaker 7:46
As it turns out, you know, they had a fairly popular volunteer program that I quickly went on to manage for several years. But once I got involved with hsbv, I just soared. I i found opportunities to be original and emotional, and I hoped to inspire, you know, others just based on continuing education and, you know, really being a progressive and science based organization that just kind of moved along and didn't get stuck in old antiquated ideas or shelter models, and so I think I just had a really unique opportunity to thrive and be involved. And as a result of me being in some of those positions where I could create opportunities to invite other talent into the organization to both educate our teams, but also the public. Dating back to the early 2000s hsbv was often beta testing for different types of behavior assessments, or, you know, cat or dog personality testing on the medical side, there were lots and lots of collaborations with local epidemiologists or veterinarians, and I think I just continued to be inspired, and I still love the idea of animal sheltering as an animal science as a stem opportunity for young people. Think it's so much more than just animal cleaning and feeding additionally, very much. Enjoy interacting with people. I think to be successful in animal welfare, you have to care for the people as much or more than you, care for the animals themselves, and I think that that was something that I always prioritized. So I met Dr Fagan as she was contributing to some of the shelters higher risk adoption decision making. So we would sometimes.
Unknown Speaker 9:59
Sometimes having animals in our care that just didn't really conform to the idea of someone's, you know, kind of ready to go easy, to re home animal. And so we would invite Dr Fagan over to kind of do a thorough portfolio review help us fill in some gaps where we were being not as creative as we could be, she would partner with our veterinary team to recommend pharmacology to be behaviorally protective of those animals while they were in the shelter or long term in a home. When I had made the decision to depart hsbv, I bumped into Dr Fagan and teasingly said, Maybe I'll come work for you. And I think just a few weeks later, it was a done deal, and I've been happy in that capacity since 2022 and in many ways, it feels like a different segment of the at risk animal population, the animals that we're seeing in this veterinary behavior center with our board certified veterinary behaviorist and the team she's assembled are animals that are at risk for re homing or behavioral euthanasia, and these families are super committed and really pulling out all the stops to try and salvage what they can and to kind of get back on course so that they can maintain the animal in their home. And I have found that to be really satisfying. And I have such admiration for these families that just don't throw in the towel.
Chrissy 11:31
Yeah, and I appreciate you bringing up the idea that when people end up going to work with animals, you have to support the human. If the human is going to be supported and successful, then the animal is going to be supported and successful. So that's a huge part of what you guys do at the veterinary behavior center. But me as well, you know, working with clients individually, like it's a huge support for the human. And I remember, you know, when Dr Fagan would come over to the Humane Society before she opened her own business, that I would meet with her and my clients, you know, in the in that meeting room. So, yeah, I remember that part. It's, it's huge support, especially, you know, for the at risk dogs and the at risk animals the human needs?
Bridgette 12:22
Yeah, I think it's important to curate a team of individuals that can have meaningful conversations with potential adopters. Help those adopters, you know, understand any animal that is perceived to need something beyond your average, you know, kind of family care. It's really important to have team members that don't overreact or under react right to a particular pattern of behavior or a singular event that has occurred. And, you know, trying to be objective and not necessarily label an animal as something that maybe they're not, but under certain conditions, certain behaviors are expressed, and the opportunity to mitigate some of that in their future home environment. You know, I think it's trying not to talk people into or out of adopting. It's just helping guide them and helping them understand what resources might be available, the time commitment that might be necessary, the transitional stress that may occur, you know, some of the conditions in which the animal may be uncomfortable, such as, you know, living with young children or in a multi animal household, there's a medical condition that's a part of it. Just, you know, having family understand what might be necessary so that you're eliminating some of those surprises that may occur post adoption. I always found that to be hugely satisfying.
Chrissy 13:57
I wanted to ask you about the predation substitute training, because you've been around for a long time, and you know all the programs, you know all the certifications. Why did you choose to get certified in predation substitute training?
Bridgette 14:12
Yes, it is such a funny, quirky twist. So I was always intrigued with the positive gun dog training in Colorado and now nationally. And at the time, I had a German short haired pointer, and while we weren't hunting together, he had those heritable traits that presented themselves recreationally and that I wanted to support. Then it was when Greg and I acquired Kokua our whip it, despite being Uber prepared for her and her breed, we had fostered Whippets previously. We, of course, did all of the, you know, textbook research and all of the things we could but I still think that her.
Unknown Speaker 15:00
Predatory behavior, the intensity and the frequency of her predatory behavior took us by surprise.
Unknown Speaker 15:06
It wasn't until she was about a year old that Greg and I started to talk about when we were walking with her, it was not like any other walk we had experienced with any other dog we had ever owned, and we were getting kind of pulled down the sidewalk, and we were really just going from tree to tree, hoping for squirrels and things. Greg and I both have fairly playful personalities, and so this didn't upset us. It just made us kind of reframe our expectations, and we started instead of asking cocoa if she wanted to go for a walk, we asked her if she'd like to go hunting. And it just made it more pleasurable for all of us, because Greg and I knew what to expect, and we let her just kind of have at it, yeah, kind of instinctually, I started to reinforce some of the parts of the predatory sequence that you would like in a dog, kind of allowing for some of the less desirable ones to occur, but trying to shape and approximate towards something more enjoyable for both of us so that we could walk, but she could hunt. I was aware of the predation substitute training, but it hadn't really occurred to me to be certified until she continued to mature, her predatory response became more and more intense, and so I just needed, personally, some education and some support. I also appreciate the force free, anti predation strategies for dogs that love to chase, obviously, as a whippet coursing and chasing. You know, that's her superpower. Once I got involved, and I really started to learn other factors involved in the certification and ways that the relationship between a dog and their teammate, their human handler, can start to install some breaks in the behavior, trying to extinguish some while really inflating others. And I found it really interesting and how each breed has, you know, different propensities towards what parts of the sequence are stronger in them than others. It occurred to me that, you know, Dr Fagan's business, while we have lots of ideas about predatory behavior, we didn't have anyone that had completed any kind of coursework, and I saw an opportunity to potentially create some curriculum or A workshop or something that we could offer to augment the workshops and classes and behavior therapies that we're already offering. Think, in 2025 there will be some version of a predation substitute training workshop for you know, pet parents and dogs that are experiencing that frustration on walks. I suspect Greg and I are kind of unique when it comes to the ability to laugh about being dragged down the sidewalk, as opposed to either just not taking your dog for a walk or, you know, frustrated and trying to control that a little differently. And so we were good natured about it, and it inspired me to do more of that so that I could hope to help other people have a more good natured approach to something that can be problematic and potentially unsafe if your dog isn't leashed or, you know, those components and so, yeah, I'm excited about it. I think it's really worthwhile. We'll see if I can put something together that can benefit pet parents and the dogs they love.
Chrissy 19:07
Yeah, I remember, I remember you saying, Chrissy, you should do this predation substitute training.
Bridgette 19:12
Yeah, I do. I remember, I remember encouraging you to do it. You were looking for something a little off beaten path. And I think it had been maybe that year, it had just kind of become a thing. I think Simone Mueller's first book had just been published, and I had read it, and I got excited about it, and so I thought it was super worthwhile. I would recommend it to professionals that are interested. Obviously, a pet parent could also do it. But, you know, it's an, it's a, you know, several months and several $1,000 so if there's somebody that can do it for you and help help with a, you know, in a coaching setting, I think that would be, I'm hoping that will be really worthwhile, helpful.
Chrissy 19:54
Yeah, so a couple things you had a personal experience that you're like, I.
Unknown Speaker 20:00
Need to figure this out. And what I love about it is that you got instead of getting angry and upset, and I'm sure you were frustrated, but you got curious, instead of punishing and getting angry about it, you just stopped for a second, and you you responded with curiosity, and then, like, how can I make this better for both of us? And so I love, I love that framework, and I love how you can work with your dog in a way that is kind and effective and not punish a behavior, you know, something that is genetically ingrained in them, you know, especially the whipit. I mean,
Bridgette 20:44
yeah, no. I mean, that was just it. I, you know, I It never occurred to me to kind of stop my pointer from pointing right. And I, you know, and I just, I guess, I had that mentality that I knew what I was getting. I knew that I was getting a sight hound that would be visually sharp and notice lots of little things blocks and blocks away and probably would wish to advance towards them. What surprised me was the ferocity in which she wanted to do so, the strength, the determination, and it was so fun for it is so fun for her. I mean, you know, now we creep towards squirrels, and when we get to about six feet away, I allow her to explode, yes, and when she explodes, and she, you know, scrambles up the tree, the look on her face when she has flushed that squirrel and is back on her fore feet and looks at me with that wide open mouth and that play face, yeah, I'm not sure there's anything better I will risk being dragged down the sidewalk as long as it takes, if that's how it makes her feel,
Chrissy 22:00
Yep, yeah, that giving them an outlet, and it makes them that enrichment is so huge. Yeah, it is feel for these dogs that have are by design, physically and emotionally built to do so it I have such sorrow for those dogs that just are continually thwarted and not allowed to express that kind of breed, typical species, typical behavior. I think we could talk forever about this, and I think maybe you should just come on again next season, so we could just talk about this.
Bridgette 22:34
Sure, I'd love to. That'd be really fun.
Chrissy 22:36
But Okay, so let's go back a little bit in time and just go to your childhood, and was there anything you learned back in your childhood you know about values, beliefs and how they shaped your thoughts, feelings and attitude toward animals, and has that changed over the years?
Bridgette 22:53
Yes, I think I had several family members that influenced me at a very early age, I recall my dad's aunt. So my great aunt and uncle lived about a half hour from us, and so we saw them on most major holidays and occasionally in the summer months between, you know, school years, and they had a licensed boarding facility, and they were breeders of Irish setters. I very much appreciated, even at the age of 10, that they dedicated so much time and were so committed to these dogs, many of them that didn't belong to them, they were being boarded for a period, days or weeks at a time, and then their breeding program was thoughtful and scientific. And the dogs they produced, I interacted with a great deal, and I always remember these, you know, what at the time were these large red dogs, you know, running around, and I think I was just so, I guess it was the first exposure I had to someone in a professional capacity, kind of really giving it their all. It was because of them that I, in my early years, thought I may be a veterinarian. I think they just continued to encourage that, and I knew by the time I was in high school that that was not likely to occur, but I don't think I ever let go of the idea of working professionally, and for my lifetime with animals after having spent time with them and their dogs, my mom was a preschool teacher and then elementary teacher, and she was terrific at that role, and she often had classroom pets, but her classroom pets were our family members, because if there was a weekend or a holiday or a summer vacation, those animals.
Unknown Speaker 25:00
Came home with her, and then I and my siblings were their primary caregivers. And so I think I also, at that young age, understood that if you're going to have an animal that is confined and kind of these little gerbils didn't have a bestie, they had my mom and her students, but I appreciated, even at that young age, how she was so committed to them and cared for them and she she always prioritized these little animals. They were never left, you know, hungry or thirsty over a long weekend, or they had a cradle to grave experience with us and with her, and I think I valued that even as a young person.
Chrissy 25:45
That's awesome. It's so interesting, because I ask everybody that question, because I feel like it's so important to see where people are coming from, but a lot of times I'm getting feedback that around the age of 10 is where people really are developing this ingrained is just in them. Yeah, so it's, it's been interesting hearing about that. Okay, so have there been any dogs that have influenced you personally and professionally, or any dogs that have where you've had any personal or professional challenges we know about your whip it? Yep.
Bridgette 26:22
Yes, she's my she would be my current example, though, I we've adjusted, and I think, you know, we're moving forward perfectly. You know, we're one big happy family with her now. Yeah, a couple come to mind. I had always had medium to large breed dogs. Personally, I've had, you know, a Pit Bull Terrier and a German short haired pointer and my first Chihuahua. Her name was ukulele, and she, I think, really changed my well. She created a personal experience for me that I hadn't previously had, and I don't know that I had the small dog judgments that a lot of people hold. I hadn't lived alongside anything smaller than, you know, 40 pounds. And so when she came into my life as an eight month old, I had an experience with her on our very on, I think it was our second walk we ever took, we encountered a woman in the neighborhood. We had a nice, polite, you know, Oh, how cute exchange. And I said, Thank you so much. I was so proud before I knew it, this woman bent over and just picked up ukulele uku kind of went, like, yay. Like, just kind of startled her, like fearfully, like a surprise, yeah, and then she was, you know, tolerant and Kissy, kissy, with the lady. But I remember right then when ukulele and I walked away, I remember saying out loud to her, I will never let that happen again. I will advocate for you differently. I just learned something because I It had never occurred to neighbors to pick up my pit bull or my pointer. You know what I mean? I just didn't even register, and because it made her uncomfortable, I learned then that I might need to to advocate for her differently and to handle her in a way that empowered her, and I think that made me a much more objective and sympathetic shelter director, because the small dogs in a shelter setting have an awful lot of overwhelm that they experience, and many shelters aren't designed to, you know, separate them out from the boisterous, large German Shepherd in the kennel next door that can peer over into their cage and, you know, make them feel threatened. And so I would say that ukulele and that first small dog experience, I had really modified the way that I interacted with and learned to understand the stress levels and the fear and anxiety that these small dog dancing in the shelter. As a result, we made lots of systematic changes to support them differently and give them little hidey beds, or let them stay in offices, or have a kennel friend, or get them out of a big, noisy room. So I think I would say she definitely influenced me that way. I think coyote was my German short haired pointer, and he really helped me understand how when you have physical medical complexities, your emotional health degrades too. Caring for him was one of the great honors of my life. He required a lot of special care, both clinically and.
Unknown Speaker 30:00
And behaviorally, I think just living alongside him and realizing that the things I thought were supportive and reinforcing his good mood days were actually adding to some of his pressure. So I think they were adding a layer of social pressure that it took me some time to sort out. So as he got less and less well, our world shrunken. Shrunk and shrunk, and I learned that for some dogs, the things that the average dog would find to be fun and motivating and rewarding for him were not
Unknown Speaker 30:45
he just couldn't handle social pressure of being out in the world. He if he hadn't had the medical conditions that he had, he probably would have had a different presentation. But I believe it was that relationship that really helped me understand how connected the physical and mental facets of every animal are so kind of intertwined, and so I think it helped me professionally, maybe go the extra Step to rule out that there may not be an irritable skin condition or an upset tummy or ear infection or anything that could just cause that little bit of distress. It was my relationship with coyote that as a shelter director and as the person that's responsible for allocating all the resources and making the decisions about, you know, how far you go with any individual animal. I think probably after that relationship, I was doing a little bit more for the majority.
Chrissy 31:55
Yeah, I think those are two huge things with small dogs. The first thing I do is because there's so many small dogs with body handling issues, because nobody respects their autonomy, they just do whatever they want with them, pick them up, throw them around, do whatever. But yep, you don't do the same thing to a Great Dane, like, right?
Bridgette 32:16
Yeah. So it's, it's great. It's one like learning how to respect a little dog the way you would a big dog, and that would decrease. I think many of the bites that little you know that you hear about what the little ja was, yeah, they, yeah, they're they become defensive because they just have no control over, you know, what's happening to them. And I yeah, I think families that adhere to the petting consent models with small dogs, any dog, but small dogs specifically, I believe, would have a much more relaxed and successful relationship and interactions with those dogs. And you know, those things are becoming more mainstream and popular. So you know, maybe next, next generation of small dogs will have better than the last generation of small dogs.
Chrissy 33:13
Yeah, working with dogs that have quote, unquote behavior issues, looking beyond the behavior, dogs hide pain so well, and it's like being a detective. It's like, you I mean, I have clients where they're like, my dog is being stubborn. They're not doing this and this and this. Well, let's, let's look and see if there's a reason why they're not doing it. And come to find out, they have joint pain. They have, you know, cervical pain, they have lumbar spine pain. And once we address that, then they start to list, quote, unquote, listen better. You know, they're happier and and so I, for me, it goes way, way beyond behavior, yeah.
Bridgette 33:54
Oh, absolutely. And the good news, I think, is that that's also becoming even in general practice in veterinary medicine, and, you know, certainly in a in a specialty practice. But I do think there is an emphasis on the connection of all of the systems and how to kind of optimally care for them, so that as a whole, they function, you know, smoothly. So I'm optimistic that the the sentiment of that, I think, will only become more and more common. And I think all animals will benefit, human animals included, yeah, yeah.
Chrissy 34:40
Yeah. The thing that really just, you know, I've talked about this before, that just really hurts my heart is when you know a dog is struggling, and you know the human decides to use a shock collar, or prong collar, and so on top of that, on top of the original pain, dog is dealing with shock pain, or.
Unknown Speaker 34:59
Prong color pain, and that just kills me. Yeah, that's why I had this podcast. Is yeah to, you know, get this information out there, yeah, yeah.
Unknown Speaker 35:10
So now we're going to talk about the holidays.
Bridgette 35:16
Yeah, we've got a couple big ones coming up. So I think your time, your timing is perfect, yay.
Chrissy 35:22
So you've seen many seasons go the holiday seasons. You know, through the Humane Society, what stands out for you the most during the holidays and for animals that are in the shelter?
Bridgette 35:33
Yeah, yeah. A couple things. Perhaps surprisingly, the thing that I remember and recall being most consistent from year to year were the weeks leading up to the holidays and the families that were relinquishing animals because they weren't expecting the animal to perform successfully through all of the holiday events like friends and family gatherings or fireworks on New Year's Eve. I think it was never surprising during that 10, to 14 days leading up to the holiday that if families were even considering it anyway, and then they were additionally confronted with a particularly tricky, messy period of time in which to live alongside that animal. I think I That surprised me. It hadn't occurred to me that there would be families making difficult and definite decisions as just a way to escape the need to either manage, but additionally, I'm certain it broke their heart to have to watch their animal be so stressed, or to have to be confined or boarded, or, you know, whatever that was. So I think I don't know that a lot of people think about how many animals are relinquished between Halloween and New Year's Day.
Chrissy 37:03
Yeah, that's interesting. I It makes you wonder, they've had previous holidays where they were really difficult. It makes you wonder, like, what is keeping them from reaching out for support, or, like, is their bandwidth just, they just don't have any more bandwidth to handle that? That's interesting to think about.
Bridgette 37:22
Yeah, and I don't know that every common Guardian is as skilled as you know certainly the two of us here having a conversation, but they might have been surprised by the interaction. And then the holiday concludes and the baseline resumes, and they've maybe almost forgotten what it was like until they get into a period of time where they're kind of confronted with having to think about all the holiday plans, and then they're like, oh, last year didn't go so well or and probably a segment of them do reach out for some support and learn that it will be a lifelong management arrangement, and not necessarily something that out of context and in between holidays is very remedial. So I mean, they can work on unfamiliar people and guest behavior and greetings and things, but when you have multiple people spending multiple days and spending the night, and you've got kids and you've got the addition of, you know, the doorbell ringing more frequently, and the Amazon packages start arriving, and it's snowing, so you're not exercised as much, and you Get all these compounding events that I think just overwhelm some families, even if they've attempted to, you know, sort it out, yeah, yeah, the animals in the shelter over the holidays kind of break your heart, right? Because No, the shelters, shelters are often closed on major holidays, and while volunteers and team members are there to provide, you know, a clean, comfortable kennel and breakfast and, you know, toileting as a shelter employee and volunteer, I can't think of a person I've ever known that just didn't have that thought on Christmas morning or Thanksgiving Day that Here you are, you know, at home, it's a day off. You're in your PJs. It's kind of one of the most relaxing mornings. And yet, these friends, your animal friends at the shelter, are kind of having a lesser day because they have less foot traffic and less visitation and yeah.
Chrissy 39:39
So yeah, I remember when I was volunteering. I always remember around the holidays, I always felt so bad for the animals that were there, and so I would go in as much as I could over the holidays and just, you know, give them love and hang out with them, and just give them all the good vibes that I could. Yeah, oh for sure. Yeah.
Bridgette 39:59
Know, I likewise, yeah, I always felt the same way.
Chrissy 40:03
Yeah. So I wanted to discuss the idea that a dog or cat isn't just for Christmas. Now, to me, that means bringing an animal companion into your life, and it's a it's a lifetime commitment, barring any and, you know, unforeseen circumstances, which sometimes that happens. But for someone who is thinking about bringing a dog or cat into their home for a holiday, holiday gift or a gift for a loved one, what are some of the top factors someone should consider when doing this to just to set everyone up for success?
Bridgette 40:36
Yeah, I think it's a really important question. I mean, I think all of the the everyday considerations still need to be met. And then there are additional considerations for these kind of busy, high stress times in people's lives. Let's start with parents with young children, right? So if you're a family that's been considering the addition of a pet, and you were planning to do so anyway sometime soon. Then I think sometimes the holidays is a great time to do so, because you've got a little bit of time at home. The kids are at home, the relationship can develop and for the right families, thinking about the right things that we're going to commit to this relationship anyway, the holidays, in many ways, are no different than if you did it on an August afternoon, right? So I think in that scenario, so long as the parents are clear that they have the parental responsibility of caring for the animal and affording the animal and all of those things, I don't see those family adoptions as much different as any other time of year. I think where things start to become a little bit more complicated is when someone outside of the household decides to secure a new pet for someone, someone that may be close to it could be a family member, good friend, a colleague, bestie, But therein lies the difference. Like you're no longer you're not there to help, right? I don't know that I would do it,
Unknown Speaker 42:18
despite the research and despite everything else, I think acquiring a pet, whether it's a bearded dragon or a parakeet, cat, dog, pony, I think it's such a personal choice, and I recommend that People make arrangements to not surprise someone with a gift, but instead determine if the individual is open to and ready for their next pet, and then just kind of make it kind of a month long acquisition. So you know, leading up to Christmas, you and that individual are visiting the shelters, you're starting to get an idea of what's there. You're starting to understand the individual's level of interest and their ability to commit and what they can afford. So I think knowing that the recipient is in it to win it. It is committed long term, and had every intention of having a new animal sometime in the next several months, is a critical component. And I just think you don't always know what someone's truly experiencing behind closed doors, what someone can afford, what their travel plans may be if they're, you know, already looking at international flights to, you know, have six weeks out of the country next year because they don't have a pet, right? So there's a lot of presumptions made on behalf of the gift giver, I still think respectfully, it would be beneficial for everyone involved, so that the individual could make the arrangements that they needed for their home. They could, you know, baby proof it. They could set aside a small savings account. And then I also think, as the gift giver, if that's the you know, decision that's made, you can't just gift the animal and then step away. You have to part of the gift should be your time and your attention. So, you know, helping someone with pet sitting or leash walking or litter box scooping, if it's a someone older or less capable of doing so, I think there's ways to partner with the individual that you believe would benefit from an animal. And you know, I just think there's.
Unknown Speaker 44:59
Ways to do it so that you're not just kind of a one and done, and you walk away with the same level of responsibility you had prior to the acquisition of an animal to gift give, but now the recipient is, you know, left spinning in their armchair because they suddenly have someone's needs to be met, and they have to plan for meals and recreation and veterinary care, and you know any of the confounding behaviors that might present themselves. So I caution people at the holidays from making some assumptions that something somebody said casually a few months ago was really a strong indicator of intent. That said there are animal shelters that have wholly embraced the puppies on Christmas morning and kittens on Christmas morning and transfer them in and give them a bath and adopt them and hold them until Christmas morning and deliver them to the porch step. You know, it's an antiquated idea to think it can't be successful for many of these families, the holiday season is not entirely different than any other chunk of time in a calendar year. I think it's really about these individuals that aren't living together and maybe making some assumptions that just aren't quite right.
Chrissy 46:35
Yeah, I agree with it's so funny that you say that, because, like with my mother in law, she lives by herself, and probably about four years ago, because she comes over, she loves the dogs that we have. They always sit on her lap like they're 80 pound dogs, and they can sit on her lap, and grandma, yeah, and she loves them, and, you know, we always worry about her being lonely. And so I was like, oh, maybe we should get her a dog or a cat for, you know, for the holidays or something. And I was like, I think we should ask her,
Bridgette 47:10
yeah. And so, what did she say?
Chrissy 47:14
I said, Would you, would you like to have a cat or a small dog, you know, in your home, she goes, No, yeah. She goes, No, I've taken care of people my whole life. I want, I need a break? Yeah?
Bridgette 47:29
No, absolutely. I mean, I just, I think, yes. I think even the most energetic animal lover from time to time, enjoys the flexibility that comes with not having to consider your pet family's needs, or to be away for a long weekend, or, I would imagine, especially as people are aging, you know, they don't perceive potentially that many more opportunities to travel and things. And, you know, I think about it from the animal's perspective, it's an awkward and potentially stressful time to enter into a family arrangement, right? It's just a busy people are often tapped out financially. They're feeling stressed. They're thinking about other new year's resolutions that they're wanting to commit to an animal that doesn't that has the wrong constitution and isn't really predisposed to a type of resilience that might be necessary to be thrust in to a whirlwind couple of weeks. Could have problems. Could be confronted with events that are uncomfortable, toys and gifts that are loud. I mean, I think of kids and the you know that Christmas Day is kind of crazy, and I can't imagine being an animal and trying to navigate that type of commotion while you're uncertain about the relationships that are in front of you, and your schedule has shifted. You don't know who you can trust or who is your advocate. I'm not saying that the average animal can't handle it, but I think there's a population of puppies kittens that aren't as systematically socialized, they just haven't experienced that type of life yet. And I think under ordinary conditions, those puppies can be successful, but I think that level of overwhelm may underscore some of the fearfulness that they're experiencing, and I just think it's risky, and I just think it's a rough time of year to have those types of expectations for those animals. I think we have to consider their feelings and their needs.
Unknown Speaker 50:00
And what will really set them up for long term success. And I don't know if that period of time for some of these animals, is it?
Chrissy 50:09
Yeah, with ginger, we rescued her, and she came from a hoarding situation in Arkansas, and she came here and she slept for the first three days like, I can't imagine if we brought her home at Christmas, like, how,
Unknown Speaker 50:24
you know how stressful that would have been for her. But I think one of the most important factors, like, no matter when you're bringing an animal into your home, is to make sure your lifestyle matches the dog's lifestyle that's one of the biggest contributing factors. And so I think it's really important when you go into the shelter to talk to the people that work there who really know that dog, yeah, and say, Hey, this is my lifestyle. Do you have any dogs that would fit into into our lifestyle, and that's a great way to start.
Bridgette 51:02
Yeah, agreed. I think it can be such a fun event for friends, you know, you know, two good friends, or, you know, me and my aunt, or, you know, grandma and grandson. You know, I think going through that process together and having that experience where you sample a variety of animals, and you talk to a variety of team members or volunteers, and you you start to really understand what your limits are, what you enjoy about the different personalities you've interacted with, what you wouldn't want to live with. You know, there's always going to be that animal that you meet at the shelter or even in a breeder situation, that is just a little more outgoing than you would like to live with, or perhaps is just a little more shy than you would like to live with. Yeah, I think about Kokua, my whip it, and she's the first dog we've ever owned where we are just not comfortable ever having her unleashed unless she is in a fenced area, because she would run right into traffic after a squirrel or a feral cat or a rabbit, if somebody wasn't considering that, she will always be physically attached by a leash, even a long line, that could be a real detractor for them as they start to figure that out, and now they're confronted with, you know, 15 potential years of living like that that just might not be something that they ever wanted to do or had considered. So I just think every animal is so unique, and every person is so unique, and I just think it's such a personal choice. I encourage people just to be really straightforward, really honest about their intentions, make the inquiry involve the individual. Then, you know, select an animal that checks all the boxes so that there's a great chance that, statistically, that animal doesn't become a gift that is then relinquished, you know, back to its origin shelter, right?
Chrissy 53:18
Super important to critically think about bringing, you, know, a animal into your home. But also there's also that emotional aspect to the connection, like you hear some people say, right away, I knew that was my dog. And so if you have those, like that instant soul connection, or whatever you want to call it, also critically think about, does this make sense as well? So, you know, the the body, mind connection type thing, having, taking both of those things into effect,
Bridgette 53:50
yeah, something I learned over the years really doesn't take long for people to feel responsible for in love with, enamored with, infatuated with whatever you want to say like a particular animal. And I think if you're going to give the gift, then involve them in the process. And part of the gift is you.
Chrissy 54:17
Oh, that's so nice.
Unknown Speaker 54:18
Yeah, yeah. Okay. So what are some tips? Just a few tips that you would say for people who do bring an animal home during the holiday season, like you said, it can be stressful for the animal and the human. What are some ways to decrease that stress?
Bridgette 54:36
Yeah, I think if you're let's go back to the family with kids, if you're the family, if you're the you know, parents of young children, and you're bringing home an animal, if you're adopting from a shelter, there are ways that the shelter may be able to accommodate a need for a little bit longer of a hold around the holidays. My suggestion, if that's the case, is that as the two adults.
Unknown Speaker 55:00
Adults in the family, you visit that little guy as much as you can in the shelter, so that that little guy recognizes you and is familiar with you to some extent prior to coming home. So I think if it's possible to effort to have a couple of experiences alongside that puppy or kitten in the shelter environment before they come home, I would that's one recommendation really thoughtfully curating in your home and area for the animal that should they need to retreat or be separated because of body language you're observing, or some behavioral expression that would indicate discomfort, or, just as you mentioned, the need to sleep off some of the shelter experience, I think it would be important to have a Part of your home designed for an animal to have, you know, enrichment and comfort and quiet, even white noise, if it helps, kind of block out some of the you know bustle of the you know events that are occurring around them. If it's an animal that comes home several days in advance of the holidays, and you're starting to get into a routine, then I would suggest making every effort to maintain that routine throughout the holidays. So if you know, if you're the family that you know brought the puppy home on the 22nd of December, you know they're going to kind of be skating through the winter with you, if you're you know kennel training, or if you're feeding at particular times, or if you're toiling toileting hourly, I would say, keep your eye on the ball, like don't lose sight of those things because you get distracted or you get busy, because that will just add to your frustration. If puppy pees on the welcome Matt, and it's 30 minutes till go time, right? I just think, if you're going to bring an animal home during the holidays, you have to take the responsibility to pay attention meet their needs notice, if they're feeling a little bit insecure, fearful, if they're learning how to signal at the door to go outside, to go potty, that you're not missing those signals because you're distracted in the kitchen. So everything you would do on an average day, but do it better,
Chrissy 57:33
yeah, and really having a safe space for them to retreat to, like you said, I think that's super important, because that over stimulation. You know, they're just done,
Bridgette 57:43
yeah, for sure. And I mean, especially for young animals that require a real delicate balance of nap time and play time, you know, I think the absence of nap time for young people and young dogs and cats can be a real bugger when it comes to the, you know, the the ability to just kind of be resilient and to take things in stride. And so, yeah, I would say, if the animal's less than a year old, I would structure some very intentional downtime in addition to everything else that's happening, yeah, yeah, okay, so say we made it through the holidays,
Unknown Speaker 58:23
and then reality sets in.
Chrissy 58:26
What are the best ways to be kind of some the post holiday blues to prevent a shelter return? Yeah, it's a good question, because, you know, Hanukkah and Christmas and Thanksgiving and and you're kind of skating towards New Year's. And New Year's is, in many ways the doozy, because it comes with champagne corks and fireworks and you know, things that you think you're through the holidays, and then all of a sudden, New Year's Eve happens. And this family and this, you know, now they're realizing that their new pet might have a sound sensitivity, right? And so, like, you kind of, you're like, Uh oh, and things kind of get a little bit stirred up again. But I'd say, if you've made it through reasonably well, and you're feeling like you're committed, that's, I think, when some of the new year's resolution idea can kick in. You know, with this new animal, like, what are your goals like now you can think more long term. You know, what are those things that can be done during the winter to prevent some Cabin Fever from setting in? You know, are there online, like learning opportunities for you and the dog or the kitty you know. Are there local group classes that you can enroll in? Are there recommended reading? I think any investment in your new pet has also been shown to increase your commitment to that pet. I.
Unknown Speaker 1:00:00
I would encourage people just to, you know, kind of start the process of, you know, aiming towards Valentine's Day, and what can we accomplish before that? And and being honest and kind of straightforward, if it's harder than you thought it would be, or you need more support than you ever imagined, or the animal has revealed a particular complicated behavior. Maybe they didn't, maybe they panicked, or were very avoidant of the children that you attempted to introduce them to over the holidays. And you know, what are all those things that you've made note of? And now rewind and out of context of a busy holiday, start that remedial process of some positive exposure and working with professionals. For me, the most important thing is just getting on a schedule with any new hat and trying to commit to it for that first, you know, period of time, six months to a year, that animals thrive on prediction. You know, they kind of know what to expect. If you've been home for the holidays and suddenly everyone's back to work and school, I think there's the consideration for, you know, being thoughtful about that first day when everyone, just like suddenly departs, I think some little approximations towards being alone or created or at a daycare, you know, I think those things can be thought about in advance and should be planned for carefully, since that would be, you know, a shift in that animal's routine And what they come what they've come to expect on a any given day. And so we would want to be thoughtful about that too.
Chrissy 1:01:47
Yeah, I think the few things that stand out that you said are routine and prediction, and then really focus on developing a bond or a connection. And you mentioned ways that you can do that. And then the third is, if something unexpected comes at that, you're like, Ooh, I'm not sure about this. Get support.
Bridgette 1:02:05
Yeah, I don't wait, yeah, yeah. Really. I mean, there's no sense in waiting, because it you may be able to get back on track. You can course correct, and you can go on to having a functional and successful relationship, or you can learn to understand that with those occasional or intermittent events that occur, where you may have visiting grandchildren, or you your daughter always brings her dogs with her on the holidays, and that didn't go well, but that's not a relationship you're willing to fracture. So all of those things, I think you can get a handle on understanding if there are remedial things you can do to make things the way you like them to be, or if you really need to contemplate if, in fact, this is a good fit for your life moving forward and the in the events that you kind of routinely engage in So personally, particularly for young animals, I'm a big fan of if you're gonna separate, separate, let that animal still be young when they re enter the shelter system, so that there's still some elasticity. And you know, the elasticity of youth that comes with kind of those transitions. And I think it's being really honest with yourself, if, if you're not inclined, then I say, rip the band aid off, yeah?
Chrissy 1:03:36
And it's, it's hard, no matter what it is, yeah. Whoo. We talked about a lot of stuff today. So is there anything that's weighing on your mind, or any negative wisdom that you would like to share with our audience?
Bridgette 1:03:50
Something I was thinking about while we were talking was a sentiment that I introduced at the Humane Society of Boulder Valley decades ago that I believe is still prevalent today, because I think it really speaks to a way of thinking about animal adoptions and animal relationships, and I think it's relevant to the holiday conversation. And the sentiment is simply, let's just say individuals enter into the process of adoption to complement their lives, not complicate their lives. And I think that is kind of a guiding light for people that are considering gifting, because you might not know what might be a compliment to someone's life, or what might complicate their lives in a way that they wouldn't have welcomed otherwise? So I would say that's my nugget. Yeah, that's a good nugget, because you you really don't know what's going on, like you said, behind closed doors, I think that community.
Chrissy 1:05:00
Is important. So if anyone would like to reach you,
Unknown Speaker 1:05:05
is there a best way to get a hold of you? I mean, I don't know, like if you see clients individually for the predation stuff, yeah, but
Bridgette 1:05:13
yeah, yeah, they can reach me at the veterinary behavior Center. My email address is Bridget C at vet behavior center.com
Unknown Speaker 1:05:22
Bridget is spelled b, r, I, D, G, E, T, T, E, C, at vet behavior center.com
Unknown Speaker 1:05:29
they can look at the website, vet behavior center.com
Unknown Speaker 1:05:33
and find me there as well. And yes, I hope in 2025 we'll have some workshop assembled that could be beneficial for people with dogs that love to hunt.
Chrissy 1:05:46
Awesome. Okay, well, we'll have to have you back for that. So, yeah, it'll be fun. So we will have all of that information in the show notes for people to get a hold of you. And thank you so much for being here. Yeah, I appreciate the invitation and happy holidays. Thank you. You too. Well, that does it for season one. Thank you so much for being here. I hope you learned how to prepare for the holidays with your new animal companion, or your surprise new animal companion. I'd love to have Bridget back to learn more about predation substitute training and the predatory sequence, because I know a lot of us have dogs that like to chase squirrels and bunnies and all those things. So enjoy the rest of the year, and I will see you back next season.
Unknown Speaker 1:06:35
Dogs truly are special beings and can change lives if we're open to what they have to teach us, this not only impacts you and your dog, but can also make a positive impact on the world. If you're finding value in this podcast, the best way to support us is by leaving a review up to five stars and sharing it with your family, friends and fellow dog lovers around the world. Lastly, I'd love to connect with you. You can find me on Instagram and Facebook at the nature of animals and visit my website at WWW dot the animal nature.com,
Unknown Speaker 1:07:08
until next time, be curious. Show compassion and have courage. You.
